Creating Distinct Audio Branding

Ian Paget: When people talk about branding, or brand identity, most people are thinking about the visuals, so things like logo design, and colours, and fonts, and stuff like that. But something a lot of people don't necessarily think about, I didn't myself, is audio branding. And that's something that I know that you guys specialise in. So I think I want to spend the bulk of the time we have now talking about audio branding. You guys help me create the music for this podcast as well, so I think, as an opening question for listeners, why would someone need audio branding?

Gabriel Agüero: Okay, first of all, Ian, I wanted to say thank you, and thank you for having us on the show.

Ian Paget: You're very welcome.

Gabriel Agüero: We're very proud of being here, and we are very proud of having worked with you and your amazing brand, that is this podcast and you as a design agency, a branding agency. So first of all, I think that, from in the times of today, nowadays, we are going through a phase where every brand, serious brand, has already developed visual branding. And that's why I think audio brand, it's actually the present and the future of how brands will differentiate themselves from each other.

Mauro González: Like Gabriel said, everything is multi-media. You have images, and video, and audio, all living in the same platforms. It could be a cell phone. It could be a computer. But everything's sounds, and you can look at it. And it's automated, and so it's good to reinforce that experience with completing it from the audio. And that's our job.

Gabriel Agüero: It's a new opportunity. There's a lot of opportunities to use sound to represent your brand.

Dalmiro Lacaze: It's taking advantage, also, of a new sense ... Well, it's not a new sense, but nowadays, you have the hearing sense, the really present in everybody's life. Everybody has a cell phone. Everybody has a computer. Back in the day, brands used to use only a jingle, because they would make one advertisement campaign for the radio or even just before the movies or for TV, so you would compose only one piece, because you would have only one opportunity to show it. But nowadays, brands are living in a digital world, especially YouTube creators, content creators, podcasts, or even, I don't know, software apps, wallets app, all that thing. It's already living in a space that sold visually and also has audio in it.

Mauro González: Yeah, and the fact that we are carrying around, in our pockets, speaker and a screen, it follows you everywhere, so brands target you, and they get to you all day long.

Ian Paget: Oh yeah, absolutely. I run a community where we meet on Zoom, every couple of weeks, and a couple of weeks ago, we did, just for fun, a quiz. And one of the questions we did was actually on audio, so we did these 10 small clips. And we played them, and you needed to guess what the music from. And it was amazing. Small things, like MSM Messenger, it has such distinct little sounds for everything. So if you put a string of those all together, you just immediately know it's MSN Messenger. And it's the same with the boot up sound of the Apple, when that was used, and the WALL-E film. You immediately get that reference, even though it's just a ding.

Gabriel Agüero: Well, do you want to do it live, right now? Do you want to play?

Ian Paget: Yeah, why not? You have it? if you have it there. This is going to be fun.

Gabriel Agüero: Okay, okay. Let's do this. Definitely, let's do this. We're going to play an audio logo, and let's see if Ian Paget can recognise what brand it is.

Ian Paget: Oh my God. I can edit this to make me sound really good... No, I'm going to do it live.

Gabriel Agüero: It would lose the fun part.

Mauro González: So audio logo number one.

[Audio Clip]

Ian Paget: Oh that is the Apple tone.

Gabriel Agüero: Yes, of our friend WALL-E.

Mauro González: Okay, okay, very good, okay, audio logo number two.

[Audio Clip]

Ian Paget: Ding... that's the Intel sound.

Mauro González: Yeah, that's an easy one.

Dalmiro Lacaze: That's actually one of the my first real experience of recognising an audio brand with a computer.

Ian Paget: Oh yeah, mine as well. I mean, anytime I think of a brand with a strong audio logo to it, some kind of sound to it, always Intel, that's the first one that comes to mind.

Mauro González: Yeah, it's the classic. Let's go to number three.

Gabriel Agüero: Let's go.

[Audio Clip]

Ian Paget: Oh, I know that one. What is that from? Something to do with-

Mauro González: The white walkers are coming...

Ian Paget: Oh, HBO?

Mauro González: Yeah.

Gabriel Agüero: Yeah.

Ian Paget: Yeah, if you didn't give a tip, I wouldn't have got that one.

Mauro González: Yeah, I like the static sound.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Yeah, the white noise.

Mauro González: Yeah, I'll play it one more time. It's heavenly.

[Audio Clip]

Ian Paget: Yeah, it immediately makes me think of Game of Thrones.

Gabriel Agüero: It's very descriptive.

Ian Paget: We don't have HBO in the UK, I don't think, other than paid for things, so yeah, I just think of Game of Thrones.

Gabriel Agüero: Yeah, me too.

Mauro González: We have the number four, easy one.

[Audio Clip]

Ian Paget: That is the Netflix sound.

Mauro González: Yeah, of course. And we have one last bonus track here. I don't know if you will get this one.

[Audio clip: Logo Geek Audio Logo]

Ian Paget: Oh my God. What is that? I don't know. Yeah, I mean, that's something I want to go into on this podcast. We can go into that now, or we can go in later on, but as part of this conversation-

Mauro González: Yeah, I was about to mention that, well, I listen to your first Halloween episode, and you were implementing the music. And it was great, great implementation. It matches everything up very nicely.

Ian Paget: Yeah, it does. It all came together so incredibly well, and even with the audio you guys created, I even felt like I need to slightly speak a little bit differently, just to go with it. So I know one thing that you guys did, obviously, at the beginning, is very positive. And the ending is very chilled out and relaxed. And that's something that sort of audience listeners know. That's something that these guys brought to the table.

I think it's worth them knowing how we connected, so I think we just started chatting on Instagram. And I never really thought of ever getting any bespoke music for the podcast made, but I have had this annoying situation where the music I used is just stock music. And that's worked for some time, but I've heard other podcasters use the same music. I've heard the same music on adverts, on lots of different places. And that's always bugged me, that it's not distinct, that someone else could be using it. It is like if you have a logo, it's like using a stock image.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Oh absolutely.

Mauro González: It is. It is.

Ian Paget: You can find something that works, but someone else has it. It's not distinct, but speaking with you guys, found out what you did, and I thought, I've got a 100th episode coming up soon, episode 101 onwards. That seems like a really good time to reboot everything. I had a little bit of money that I could put to one side for doing it, and you guys did an incredible job, so thank you for kind of bringing it all to life. I think it's come together really nicely.

Gabriel Agüero: Thank you. Thank you. I can't say how appreciated we are, and I think that what you said is one of the most beautiful things about this work, because it's about branding and getting to know yourself even better. I think that we kind of connected in a way that, as you said, I think it's amazing that you embrace the way you talked a little bit better and kind of appreciated the distinctiveness. I think it's amazing, and it's getting to know oneself a little bit better, and that's great.

Ian Paget: Yeah, I think that was one of the things that I found with this process, because when I first came to you, although I listened to music, in terms of what Logo Geek would sound like, I've never really thought about it. And I know the music I had, I kind of liked it. It did the job, but I could never pinpoint what it was that I didn't like about it, and when we spoke, I remember saying to you guys that I do want something that's maybe a little bit geeky. Or there's something to it that has some reference to it, but I don't want it to be tacky. And I never had anything set in my head of what it could be. I actually felt like, to some degree, I was kind of rambling to you, as to what I would potentially want, but how you translated that was amazing.

Dalmiro Lacaze: It's really becoming an important question, how does your brand sound?

Ian Paget: Yeah. I think it'd be worth going into process, and we can go more into how you guys create the sound for Logo Geek a little bit later on, but with logo design, I love going into the process stuff, so if you'd be happy to share some of that, that would be amazing. So what is your process for creating a sound for a company?

Dalmiro Lacaze: Well, the first thing that we do, it's all about getting to know the client. When we have a chat, we discuss things that seem a little bit abstract, like for example, describing in one or two words a sound but mainly using words to describe emotions or feelings. And what we take from that, it's not only the word but how the client says it and what emphasis it put on the way.

And we do a video call, so we get to see the face he puts when he talks about this. For example, he might say, it might sound tacky, or it might sound bold and enjoy. We look for the face expression and the sound expression of the way that he's saying that word. And then it's a little bit of a weird process, because we might take that and sleep on it and come up with something that sometimes is out of the no work creativity. Sometimes it's something that it comes through, and we try to translate that into sound.

Gabriel Agüero: I want to add something to what Dali's saying, that we kind of do our research about how the brand, from where it's coming, and where it wants to go, and we also need this critical to kind of feel the decision-makers and the people that are going to finally approve our project, so we can understand their vision of what they think they need. And then, we process all that and create our vision of what they actually need, that I think that US graphic designers have visual brander. Understand completely what I'm trying to say, right?

Ian Paget: Oh yeah, absolutely. I think the process, in terms of the way that you guys work, is very similar to working on a logo design or a brand identity project, because I remember when we first spoke about it. So when we did that initial call, I do remember you asking, or one of you guys asking, about my use of colour.

So the previous identity was very blue and black and white. I've consistently used that. I've now injected a little bit more colour into that, and we'll do more of that ongoing, but yeah, I remember that asking, do you want to keep it blue? And I'm like, what do you mean by that? And it was a useful question, actually, because it helped me to describe where I would like to take it, rather than where the identity is currently now. So it was interesting, going through the process of sound. Going through that helped me to think more about the identity, but once I heard the sound, I just started to picture what everything else could look like. It was totally unexpected.

Mauro González: Yeah, and the more and more you use it and you listen to it, it will grow on you. And it will be even more yours, or if that's a word. You will own harder, through time.

Ian Paget: Yeah, yeah, well, it's like a logo. I can't remember who coined the term, whether it's Michael Bierut or Sagi Haviv, but someone said a logo is an empty vessel when you first use it. And I think that a sound is exactly the same, that the more it's associated with that thing, when you hear that sound, it absorbs all of the meanings associated with it. It's exactly the same thing. There's so much overlap with identity work.

Gabriel Agüero: Love that quote.

Mauro González: Yeah, very interesting. I just want to say, it's very different for us, when we think about a project and we do all the intelligence part of where are we going to and what this brand needs and everything. It's different, if it's a brand, maybe, I don't know, a food chain or a credit card, it's more clear the goals. And we sell more-

Dalmiro Lacaze: The target.

Mauro González: The target. So when it's a personal brand, it's more kind of we lean towards the gut feeling we get from the person, and then we feel more free to experiment. In your case, where we were thinking about nerdiness and geeky and all that kind of stuff. And then we said, what's the geekiest instrument we got here? And we said, well, we have this pocket operator that it's very cool, the sound thing. It's kind of like a calculator, if you see it, you look at it.

Ian Paget: You sent over that video. I think I put that video in the show notes (see below). It's cool. As soon as I saw it, I wanted one of those.

Gabriel Agüero: That's why I sent you the link in my email.

Dalmiro Lacaze: They come up with one new pocket operator that has sound from Capcom, from the video company. And you get a sample pack of Capcom and Street Fighters and the fighting sounds and all that. That just brand new.

Mauro González: Very nerdy. Also you have Rick and Morty themes and that kind of ... Teenage engineering, they are great.

Gabriel Agüero: I want them all.

Mauro González: That's very personal.

Ian Paget: I mean, yeah, I think, in terms of that sound, like I said, it was totally not what I ... I didn't imagine anything like that, but the more I listened to it, I thought, you know what? That's so distinct.

Mauro González: It is.

Ian Paget: I'm going to go with it. I like it.

Gabriel Agüero: That's great. That's great. We are so happy with it.

Ian Paget: So do you want to talk about some of the tools and stuff that you would use when working with client? So I know you've briefly gone into how you would understand a client's requirements, and I've been through that process, so when we worked together, I think it was maybe an hour. We spoke for some time about what I imagined, what I like about the music I currently have now, where I see the brand ongoing. You asked lots of questions, some of them really random, but actually, now I've heard what you've put together, I just remember when I listened to both of them, because there was actually two different tracks that you guys created for me. And both of them, I thought, that's amazing that you translated all of that into something. So after that call, so you've gone through that call, what happens next? Where do you take that, in terms of next steps?

Dalmiro Lacaze: Okay, after your call in particular, of course, because of the pandemic, we started working a lot more remotely. What we're doing right now, when we are remotely, we tend to divide and present options. For example, in your case, we did two compositions. One was done by Mauro. That's the one that you ended up choosing, and the other one was done by me. And what we get there is two complete different approaches and two ways of filtering the conversation, so I might have an idea, and Mauro might have another one. That way we know we're in the same page, because we know each other from a long time. But we know we're going to have two different sides of it.

Ian Paget: Yeah. It was really hard to pick between the two of them, because as you said, they both took the same general idea and references from the conversation but took them in two completely different directions. And as a client of yours, that was actually really interesting, to hear two different sounds. So it's interesting how you've approached that, so like you said, you have that conversations. Then you decide to both take on the project and create what you would picture. What do you to interpret that?

Dalmiro Lacaze: We don't listen to each other's things until we have something to deliver.

Ian Paget: That must be cool for you guys. It must be exciting to hear. How are you translating it?

Mauro González: Yeah, because it has happened. Oh, listen to this, and next day you go, and everybody has the same sound, because you influence them with your track. So we try to keep it like, okay, let's show everybody at the same time, the track, so we don't steal to each other's ideas.

Ian Paget: Oh, that's good. It's good. It makes for a more interesting service, I think, for potential clients.

Dalmiro Lacaze: And the thing that we tend to think alike, but we also think different enough that we complement each other. But the thing is that if somebody shows something a little bit too early, we tend to gravitate to that idea, because we're not very different, but we are different in a way that if we are separate, we come up with totally different things. But if somebody else listens to something of the other one, it's like we click, because we tend to support our ideas a lot. And we tend to kind of retro off to feedback from it.

Gabriel Agüero: Yeah, we also have the same tools. We all use the same software, and we kind of connect with each other in a way that we can work together or separate.

Mauro González: Yeah, we generated a pre-established ...

Gabriel Agüero: System.

Mauro González: Yeah, with software and tools, and the pandemic also helped us to polish every single home ... Well, nowadays, everybody has a home studio, and also we have the main studio, so the pandemic helped us to buy a couple more things and ...

Dalmiro Lacaze: Practice.

Mauro González: ... practice more, and also with audio, it's very easy. It's not heavy files, like video, right? So we can send all the time, like okay, well, I sent you this track. Send me that one. And I will continue this project. And it's very easy for us.

Ian Paget: It sounds really, really good, so you guys mentioned tools that you use for listeners that might be interested in going into this area in some way. Would you be open to sharing what tools you use?

Gabriel Agüero: Yes, of course, of course, we use Ableton.

Mauro González: Ableton.

Gabriel Agüero: We found that through our journey, or some decisions, we went through a lot of doors and different softwares, but we're really happy with Ableton, and actually, we bought the license, I think, a couple of months ago, because we were in the trial. And it is such an amazing tool that we actually bought it. And then, depending on the brand, we also tend to record a lot of sounds that are not really instruments, but because of the sound itself, that's how we tend to do things that are very unique, right?

Mauro González: Yeah, Ableton helps us. I realise, not very much time ago, that Ableton is a tool to build tools. So we were used to, oh, let's use this versatile instrument or download this plug-in and play around with the knobs. But now, we realise that a tool to make tools, so we make our own instruments and our own effect racks, and it's limitless.

Ian Paget: So is that some kind of hardware, just so that I can understand what it is it?

Gabriel Agüero: Oh, no, no, it would be like-

Ian Paget: Is it software?

Mauro González: Yeah, like Photoshop or Premiere but for music.

Gabriel Agüero: It would be like if you create your own filters and your own colour palette and all. Everything must be unique and different.

Ian Paget: I think what I did is link to it in the show notes, and then people can go in, look into if they're interested in making music. It sounds fascinating. I've never heard of it. I've obviously never made music or can't play music. Do you use real instruments and stuff like that, or with this new tool you started using, does that allow you to do a lot of things electronically?

Mauro González: Yeah.

Dalmiro Lacaze: It's kind of a mix and match between both worlds, depending on the project. Yeah, we might record real instruments, and we might actually no record any real instruments. But we might, for example, record only one string of a guitar and with that, we make digitally a whole new instrument. That's the tool for making tools.

Gabriel Agüero: Depending on the sound you want to achieve, we would use the best of both worlds.

Mauro González: Yeah, we have keyboards, and guitars, and basses-

Gabriel Agüero: Drums.

Mauro González: ... drums, all sorts of instruments. Well, that's when we started, and we taught. And we were in a band, and we were so into instruments. And nowadays, it's kind of 50/50, but the computer, it's very time consuming, and you really need to spend time in getting to know how to tweak the sound, just because it's so limitless, digital audio.

Ian Paget: Yeah, yeah, I think it'd be worth going into how you guys also approach creating those sounds, because when we worked together, you didn't just create everything. You created an introduction, two introductions, that I could pick from, and I think as part of that, you also did an audio logo of that as well. And I'd never heard the term audio logo, prior to speaking to you guys. So do you want to talk a little bit how of what you tend to provide at the beginning and then how that's developed further with a client?

Gabriel Agüero: Yeah, yeah, of course, we usually tend to create the audio logo first, because it's easier for us, but depending on the project we create, we create a certain box of audio assets for our brand. And in this case, that it was a podcast show, we usually create a shows intro, an audio logo, a branded logo and an outro. If you want, we can go through them and listen to them.

Mauro González: This is the intro of your show.

[Audio: Logo Geek Intro Sound]

Mauro González: I think it will be at the start of this, every show.

Ian Paget: Oh yeah, it'd be at the start of this episode. I really like it. It puts a smile on my face.

Gabriel Agüero: That's the whole idea.

Ian Paget: Yeah, so that's the introduction, and then in terms of the audio logo, do you have that to hand as well?

[Audio: Logo Geek Audio Logo]

Ian Paget: So you can hear, it's based on the same thing, but it's a really short version, so what I can do with that is I can add that to a logo and do an animated logo, which I'll probably do that at some point.

Gabriel Agüero: Yes, and you can use it for shorter content in other platforms.

Ian Paget: Yeah, and then you did a loop as well, which is a short piece that has a similar sound to that, and once I signed off the intro and the audio logo, that's when you then developed the outro music, which will be at the end of this episode. I mean, you can play it now if you have it. But it is quite long, so I'll save it for the end of the episode. But it's a lot slower, calmer. It has a similar vibe to it, and like I said, when I used music previously, I just used the same with the beginning at the end, but actually, after speaking with you guys, it makes sense to change the tone and the mood of the audio to show that you're at the start, and at the end.

Gabriel Agüero: And if I may say, the outro is my favourite pieces, my favourite audio asset, because it is kind of where we can express ourselves, as artists, and be freer, creatively.

Mauro González: Also, regarding the question you had before, in that project, the outro we're speaking about, the outro, it has real guitars. I picked a slide, and one could make some takes and also a bass. So there's real stuff happening.

Ian Paget: Yeah, it's amazing. I can really hear that, and you guys put a lot of time and energy into creating a sound for Logo Geek. And like I said, it was unexpected. I didn't know what I was going to be hearing when I listened to that, so how you translated that intro into a closing piece. It has quite a different sound, but there are a lot of characteristics to it. But it's similar to the introduction, but that opening piece has a real charm to it, and it's got the positive vibes. And it is a bit nerdy, like I said, and I just feel it seems really appropriate for how I want the podcast to be. And then the end music is quite chilled out, but it still has some of those features, and I just think it works. It all came together really nicely.

Mauro González: I think it's good to set the people, uplifting thing, it's coming something, you prepare them, and then, okay, the journey's done. Okay, you can relax now. It's all done. And then, when you're starting another episode, you get to that excitement again. That's kind of how we thought about it.

Gabriel Agüero: It's like you are conducting people through the music, and you give structure to each episode. The branded loop also works for if you're having rhythm to the speech it gives, while you're on brand always. So I think that in this particular case, I really like how things turned out.

Ian Paget: Yeah, came together really nicely. Would you guys be open to sharing the other direction you did?

Mauro González: Yes of course.

Ian Paget: Yeah, yeah, I think it'd be good for audience listeners to hear, and I'd actually love to see what people think of it, have one preference toward one or the other. I'm not going to change it, but it's just, I'd be very curious, and I'd cross my fingers that they agree that I made the right choice, because like I said, when I first heard both of them, I actually didn't know which one to pick. And at first, the other one, that we're going to play shortly, when I first heard that, I thought, yeah, that's the one I want to go with.

And it was just over time, the more I listened to them, there was something about the one that we ended up using that put a smile on my face. It was like picturing strolling along, and as you stroll along, things are creating around you. Colors are coming in and stuff like that, and it's also something that I haven't heard anything like that before. And thinking about it like a logo, being a logo designer, differentiation is absolutely key. And having that filter it, it just made me think, okay, I think that's the way I need to go. I think that will work so much better, and hopefully, listeners will agree. So if you have it to hand-

Dalmiro Lacaze: It's really nice. It's really nice what you just said.

[Audio Clip]

Dalmiro Lacaze: Can you hear it?

Ian Paget: Yeah. Yeah, so you can see, what I like about that one is it was quite uplifting. It has a lot of quite nerdy, little, chirpy references in there. And I really love it. It's just the more I listened to both of them, because you guys mentioned to sit on it and listen to them both a couple of times, it's just the one allowed me to picture something in my head. And the other one didn't quite have that, for me, so that's why I personally went in the direction that I did. But yeah, I think you guys really nailed it and created two very distinct sounds.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Right. Right choice, I think. I even saw, I remember, before sending anything to you, when we first hear both options, I said to Mauro, "It's definitely going to be this one," what you end up choosing. And we finish up the other track, and we were discussing. And I would say to the guys, "It's perfect," because this other track, it's going to even support more the track that you choose.

Gabriel Agüero: It's like both are great, but one is a little bit more techy, maybe a little bit darker, and the other one is so distinct that it was, as Dal says, it supports the choice of the Logo Geek.

Mauro González: Yeah, it's sort of kind and uplifting in a way, almost in an innocent way, and I really like that. It's shiny and sunny. I like it.

Ian Paget: Yeah, it's why I've slightly modified how I'm also doing the episode artwork, and I wanted to keep the blue and the black and white, because I've been using that for so long now. And I think that's become part of it, but I have considered a number of times, maybe injecting some yellow. And just hearing the music, I started to picture more colours like that, so I have pondered a little bit more yellow. I'm open to some other colours as well, but it helped to kind of cement the direction I want to take the podcast and the brand ongoing. And there's so many design podcasts now. Everyone's kind of doing them. There's loads of designers out there, but I think it's very distinct, and I think it works really nicely with Logo Geek, in terms of that you used something that's the nerdiest musical instrument you have and sound and the upliftingness to it. And I just think it works perfectly.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Thank you. Thank you so much.

Ian Paget: Okay, so I wouldn't mind going into your background story a little bit, because you mentioned earlier on that you ... Were you three guys in a band?

Mauro González: Yeah.

Gabriel Agüero: Yes.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Yes.

Ian Paget: Yeah? All together in a band?

Gabriel Agüero: Actually with Dal and me, we met when we were seven years old, in second grade, and never split apart. We became passionate about music, and I started playing drums, Dali, guitar, and we had a band. And we were from Patagonia. We were born in Patagonia, and when we turned 18, we came to Buenos Aires to music college. That's where me met Mauro.

Mauro González: Yeah, let me add something. We mentioned we were in a rock band. I also want to mention that when I met Gabriel, he had very long hair, and I did as well.

Gabriel Agüero: You were not supposed to say that.

Mauro González: No, no.

Ian Paget: I think we need photos, photos, photos.

Mauro González: I had long hair too, almost to the waist. So we were three long-hair hippies-

Gabriel Agüero: Learning metal.

Mauro González: ... learning music in Buenos Aires, and we were forming a band, of course.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Now I have grey hair.

Mauro González: Now, we are part of the establishment now. But yeah, what crazy years, lots of fun, and lots of learning too. The music's cool, whispery, cool place to be, learning with professionals.

Gabriel Agüero: Hit a lot of walls, understanding what to do, what not to do, and when we were college mates, classmates, friends, and bandmates, and then, we became partners, when I started working in the biggest TV network station, here in Argentina. And we stumbled up on the opportunity to create music for the TV identity, for the brand. And Dal was, at that point, studying in Berkeley, so we started with Mauro, doing the music for the TV station. Then when Dal came back, we absorbed him, and started working with us again. And we actually didn't know what we were doing, because we didn't know that we were doing audio branding for a brand and its identity, so a lot of years went by, without us realising what we were doing, just we kind of had a big plan, and that was that.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Yeah, we stumbled upon it, as we were doing it. It was kind of weird there, the whole discovery thing.

Mauro González: Yeah, also now, in December, it will be 10 years of the channel's identity we've working. This year, it's turning 60 years, this channel we are speaking of, the El Trece, it's called, 13. And what, 10 of those 60 are us, so-

Dalmiro Lacaze: That's six of it's history.

Mauro González: ... every single communication that El Trece had made, it has our audio in it.

Gabriel Agüero: Yeah, I think that we really don't realise what a part of TV we are, but because we are doing it ourself, and in a part, we were commissioned by Future Brand. I don't know if you guys know about them. It's a global branding agency.

Ian Paget: Yeah, I've heard of Future Brand, so are Future Brand using your services to develop music?

Mauro González: Yeah.

Gabriel Agüero: Yeah, they commission us, a really big project-

Dalmiro Lacaze: South American level.

Gabriel Agüero: ... that is DirecTV, that is a brand of satellite, or TV operator here in the operational level, here in Latin America. Was doing a rebranding, and they connected with us for creating their audio logo. And at that point, that was the Eureka moment, when Mauro told me, hey, this audio branding thing, it's big. And when he told me that, I at first didn't realise it. And after a few months, kind of the information sunk, and I started working. I started reading and learning about branding books and read. I became mental. I became obsessed about it. And from that point on, all we did was audio branding. It's like we niched down on creating brands' sound identities.

Mauro González: Correct me if I'm wrong, GaryVee post, a paper, he uploaded, in 2017 and 2018, I don't know. He said this is the next big thing, and well, he has his audio logo for a couple of years now. And he uses it all of the time. Everybody knows it.

Gabriel Agüero: It's his signature.

Ian Paget: Yeah. Yeah, well, it's a great example of audio branding. It's a funny thing, because you don't really notice it until you keep hearing it. And then you hear that sound again, just out of the blue, and you know exactly what it's associated to. And I think it's-

Gabriel Agüero: Very powerful.

Ian Paget: Yeah, it's powerful and potentially untapped territory, in a lot of cases. I bet there are some industries that just don't use it at all now, and it's one of many ways of differentiating from the crown, or when you're talking about branding, in general. Like I said at the beginning of the conversation, most people think of fonts, and colours, and logos, and images, but actually, there's this whole relatively untapped territory with audio, and how you create audio logos, so that's the first sound that you hear, just this more or little couple of second sound. It's an absolutely fantastic way to differentiate from others and give your brand personality and everything.

So when you guys came to me, I just thought, damn, this is good. And I think, in terms of what you created as a service with music branding, I think you guys, you don't just create music. The overall experience of what you developed is actually very pleasant too, so I'm just going to add that it's the three of you working together, but you don't have your separate email addresses. When I email the one email address, it's like you all are kind of act as one, which is really cool.

And there's been a number of things that you've done. I can tell that you guys really understand branding, because it's not just about the sound. You have your logo and everything. Any time you sent over a little video, it's got the little logo coming in, with the sound and just the tone of the emails, you had little emojis. And when I received the audio files, you didn't just send it and leave me to it. You made a nice little video that shown me through it.

Gabriel Agüero: I think I'm falling in love with you.

Ian Paget: I think of terms of what you created, it's a very streamlined business. It's very clear what you sell, the product that you get. Everything we talk about on this podcast, you guys have really nailed it, so I don't know how you guys are doing, in terms of success with the business, but if you're not already flying, you will be at some point soon, because it's just I really think you nailed it. And you're going to get recommendation after recommendation after recommendations, because I think you do a great service, but you go the extra mile as well, and I think you're a good example for listeners for how to do it right.

Mauro González: Well, thanks, thanks a lot.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Thanks very much.

Mauro González: And I think I like that you felt this nurturing, this pampering, we try to make with clients. Being a boutique branding agency, all your branding agencies, it's always very close. You're speaking directly to the founders, and we take the time and all the things. We really appreciate that you appreciate.

Ian Paget: Yeah, yeah. No, I can really see that, because like I said, now that I work as an independent, I'm working with more and more businesses. And it's just the way that you did it, I think you kind of set the bar of how to do this type of thing, because I've gone to a lot of events. And people talk about one service or one person and just keeping it simple but doing it very well. And people listening to this, there would be a lot of designers that own the room, agencies, so probably logo design branding and stuff like that, but I just think you're a good example of someone that's doing it right. It's just simple. The offering is simple. It just makes sense, so give yourself a pat on the back I think. You've done a great job.

Gabriel Agüero: Okay, thank you, thank you.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Thanks a lot Ian.

Gabriel Agüero: I reckon all our creativity to not only the product itself or the service that we do that is creating music. We developed a really good product for the media content we give you, and that kind of thing, I think it, as you said, we are betting on it. We are betting on creating and expressing and being able to story tell what we do for your brand. And I think that's very valuable as well.

Ian Paget: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Well, we're nearing the end of our time, so I want to throw one last question at you, and it's one that I like to add on the end of most episodes, if we have the time. So imagine if you was to get into a time machine, and you could go back in time, to any point in your life, in your career. It could be last week. It could be 10 years ago. But you could only give yourself one piece of advice before you return. What advice would you give yourself?

Dalmiro Lacaze: Choose piano.

Mauro González: Yeah, I think we are three thinking about the same thing, learn to play the piano better.

Gabriel Agüero: Of course.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Yeah, the decisions, the career choices, for example, Mauro chose guitar. He also plays bass. He also plays drums. Gabriel studied drums, and I studied guitar.

Gabriel Agüero: And projection.

Dalmiro Lacaze: And projection, Gabriel, so all of us, for example, Mauro and I play a little bit bass. Everybody plays a little bit of piano, but it's not our main instrument, and nowadays, with the whole media thing and computer thing, it's a mess to know how to really perform in piano.

Gabriel Agüero: Yes, I would definitely tell my 18 old Gabriel, to learn to play piano. It's so flexible, and little I know to play, it made me think of music in another way. So I think it would definitely be wise advice for someone that is starting their music journey.

Ian Paget: Yeah. Yeah, that's good to hear that, actually, because I got a little daughter. She's a year and a half old now, and we wouldn't mind getting her some kind of musical instrument. And it's interesting that you say piano, so anyone that's listening out there, yeah, if anyone's listening out there, interested in music, that sounds like a good piece of advice.

Mauro González: Yeah, I also would tell myself, 10 years ago, get yourself a MacBook Pro. And we have so much struggle with Windows, and well, at the beginning, you start cracking software. And that's how you start. And with Windows and interface and everything, it was so, so messy. And when we went Apple, everything changed, and also, get real software and pay your licenses. That would be a great-

Ian Paget: Yeah, yeah, I mean, to be fair, it's easier now, especially with the Adobe software, it's actually affordable to get for the entire year. But when I was learning, I can't remember how much it was, but I recall it being thousands of pounds to get the software. So I did the same thing, when I was younger, but I think it's a lot accessible now, especially for students. Adobe have student prices, and most software packages ... And I'm kind of going to say it's probably because of the iPhone and tablet computers. It's made software more affordable than ever before, so actually getting proper software, I don't think there's any excuse now. There's not really the need to Torrent stuff anymore.

Gabriel Agüero: Definitely, definitely, and I believe that it supports the industry and also kind of want to believe that you are helping each other, and that will come back in a way. And it's like everything positive as well.

Ian Paget: Yeah, definitely. I totally, totally support that as well. And that's probably a good point to wrap up the interview. So guys, the Drop Music Branding Team, thank you so much for coming on the podcast, and thank you again for the music. I fell you've helped me to raise the bar with the podcast. It's something that I've been quite excited about, so thanks for coming on the podcast.

Mauro González: Thank you. Thank you for having us. We love so much to be on your podcast.

Dalmiro Lacaze: Yeah, thanks very much for providing the space and the opportunity to tell our story and how we did this, the audio branding for your show and for your brand. And it was a really nice pleasure to work with you. You're really easygoing person, and I really love all the things that you said about the process and how you felt it.

Gabriel Agüero: Yeah, thanks, Ian, we really appreciate you. Thank you.

Ian Paget: You're very welcome.